Roots Archives Forum

Glad to, MightyZ. I thought the stories/history might help with figuring out why the word is used today.

I notice Rastas use the word "Rome" or "Romans" in a similar way.

Interesting Jason - I can only think of one example of 'Rome' in a song - Prince Jazzbo 'Natty pass through Rome, Natty don't use comb'. Can you enlighten me further - I'm curious now, especially as I don't share the traditional view in Britain that 'The Romans were good for this country' - mainly because they systematically discredited and destroyed Celtic culture, making it hard to know what this country may have become without their influence!

MightyZ

horace andy's "rome" "...is not for me...could never be" "i want to live where the air is fresh is clear..."

sums up the same sentiment as jazzbo's chune.

Love Horace Andy (coincidently listening to Mr Bassie right now!) - but don't know that one - will have to check it out - what album is it on?

MightyZ

Jason Allen wrote: I'd also add that Babylon was an actual place in Mesopotomia (now Iraq). The Biblical implications were that the king of Babylon, King Nebuchadnezzar, forced God's people to forsake their beliefs and bow down to idols. This is where the stories of Daniel and the Lion's den and Shadrach, Meschach, and Abednego come from. They're stories close to persecuted people's hearts (like the rastas) because they teach that you have to stand firm and have faith in the face of political systems and leaders that try to force you to do things you find detestable. Even if it means you might be persecuted or killed.
There are many other stories (Tower of Babel, Nimrod, etc) about Babylon. It was a long lasting kingdom that persistently seemed to clash with Israel and it's beliefs. Because of this it has come to symbolize the persecution of people who follow the Jewish or Christian beliefs. Although, I know here in the States it would be VERY hard to find a church service where the minister spoke about Babylon (or Zion for that matter). Seems like that sort of thing gets glossed over.

Yes, I'm essentially in line with what Jason added above, but as for what it means today... If any have the chance and are so inclined, read the entire chapter 18 of the book of Revelation. I am of the belief that Babylon (and "Babylon the Great" mentioned in Rev. 18) represent the ENTIRE world empire of false religion...and, of course, the worldly governments and commercial system(s) are "in bed" with her, so to speak, so they can be termed a part of her too. There's an older book entitled "The Two Babylons" by Alexander Hilsop that makes some interesting comparisons...

OK, that's my 2 cents on the topic...

Peace.

TJ wrote:
Yes, I'm essentially in line with what Jason added above, but as for what it means today... If any have the chance and are so inclined, read the entire chapter 18 of the book of Revelation.

i haven't read Revelation for over 20 years, but i have to agree from what I remember that it echoes rather scarily the world of today!

Better make sure you are doing good works people!

MightyZ

MightyZ- I haven't looked at any of my albums but three excellent tracks that come to mind are:
Freddie McKAy-Rome
Black Slate- Romans
Jacob Miller- Roman Soldiers of Babylon (Miller's title implies they are one and the same)

I gather that a lot of people blame the Roman co-opting of the early Christian church into it's government for a lot of bad historical events (the Crusades, etc). The Roman Emperor, Constantine, saw a vision that he believed the Jewish God, Jehovah, had sent him while he was waging war. Ever after he claimed Rome was a Christian Kingdom. However, his tactics and beliefs mixed politics and war with Jesus teachings and began the cycle of intolerance and violence waged by the Roman governement in the name of God.
Before Constantine had this vision the Romans had sought to hunt and eradicate any Christians and would put them in the arenas to be fed to tigers, massacred, etc. That is why the catacombs were formed--to hide.
Even before that, Romans, like the Babylonians, waged war on the nations surrounding it, like Israel, and forced these nations to follow their rule. Rome was in charge of Israel during the time of Jesus.

TJ, thanks for adding in the New Testament passages about Babylon. Like you said that's the Babylon most people talk about existing today.
John the Revelator's version of the future Babylon he sees is called the"Whore of Babylon" or Mystery Babylon. Revelation chap 17 states John saw Babylon as:
"the great whore that sits upon many waters: with whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication." (This wine isn't alcohol but made from the blood of the martyr's and saints.)
I believe this again points to oppressive, evil, and corrupted hierarchies that want to persecute the martyrs and saints because of their God.
This is of course a graphic and apocalyptic vision. However, Nebuchadnezzar burning people alive and feeding them to Lion's is pretty gruesome, too. Seems like Babylon's purpose is always to stamp out those who try to be righteous. In the end though righteousness always prevails.

Tell them breddah Jason



MightyZ

I just re-read my posts and realize they come across as a little know-it-allish. Didn't mean for that to happen. I obviously just love this type of stuff. Ancient religious battles, prophecies, kingdoms rising and falling.......
It really is all very fascinating (at least to me).

Babylon is most simply anyone who try to downpress i and i. Could be anyone, whoever try to stop di righteous is babylon..most likely police man wan fi tek mi sensi, but that cant right.