Roots Archives Forum

It's been a long time I didn't post here but this is indeed a very interesting thread.

As for Pressure Sounds which was mentionned above and is still alive, I can say from discussions I had with their staff that not long ago they were very near to stop releasing albums. Why ? I don't think it's only a question of money or interest. It's just that it's becoming too hard, taking too much time & effort to release an album for what it's worth and how much it sells. Even if you have a real passion, sometimes you feel like you have to let it go.

Another point I heard many times from record companies staff is : is there many great albums left to be reissued ? Honnestly I don't (and they don't) think so. I think lots of collectors will agree on this point : the rarest album may be rare for a good rason ; it's not a great (or sometimes even good) album. Keep in mind that many many albums have been reissued already these last years and you can't expect to make good sales with an unknown artist even if the music is good. The only way to make a good reggae reissue now is to compile singles and make a various artist compilation. That means more problems to get the copyrights, more people to deal with, more money to spend etc ...

I feel like in the next years the reggae reissue market will nearly disappear. I expect that 80% of the output will be compilations of tracks already reissued and only from the big names like augustus pablo, lee perry, etc ...

There is also imo a huge lack in the distribution of reissued records (not only in reggae). I often ended in big stores with nothing to buy. In France it can take up to 2 months before a Pressure Sounds release hits the FNAC or Virgin stores. Why would people fight to buy something when they can get it for free on internet ? It's even weirder that many CDs get an illegal internet release before it's sold anywhere.

As said above, the music industry is broken. Marketing is now the main (only ?) vector of sales. Is there a way to make agressive marketing on reggae reissues ? of course not. When I take a look at MTV or others it's obvious the target is 13-16 years old people. Do they buy reggae reissues ? of course not

Conclusion : game over.

A lot of small reggae labels like Pressure Sounds, VP and Greensleeves were distributed by Pinnacle in the UK. Just last week Pinnacle ceased trading. Pinnacle has been the main UK distributor for about 25 years, with all types of dance music:
Hip-Hop, Jungle, Reggae, Drum & Bass, all styles right through the 80`s and 90`s.
Other distributors that went out of business in December are EUK and Wndsong.

One by one the labels will be going out of business, just like the distributors. When CD`s started coming out with recorded music on them, some people thought it would change sales of vinyl, now we have the download generation. If, as an artist, you have to sign up to Itunes, otherwise you ain`t got a career in the music industry. To promote or/and live gigs. Live gigs is the only way to earn money from the music bizz these days and an LP/CD is just a promotion tool to promote the artist to see them live and pay the money. So it don`t matter the LP/CD made a loss in being ripped off on downloads and 4 cents a Itune.

Now its going right down the snakes and ladders, from the small labels, distributors, and now major record labels are now in trouble and rely on films they make in Hollywood, CBS/Sony/Columbia, MCA/Universal and so on. Sony which makes equipment from computers to tape recorders has not put all its eggs in one basket, unlike some of the other major labels.

I still think there will be many re-issues but on 7` vinyl and done in JA by the people involved with the original. The time for the re-issue LP/CD is over. 7 inch records are easier to distribute.

It`s the same with books: you have a normal book, then there`s Ebooks which i don`t think will take off like a novelty. It`s not the same reading a book off the computer screen than, holding a book and turning the page. Its so easy these days you don`t even have to turn a page in a book.

From about 1996 to 2007 at lot of re-issued reggae from the 70`s and 80`s was being released. Now its just websites fighting for pennies, but the pennies add up thats why Itunes wants to corner the market on the internet which, you`re always going to get things cheaper somewhere else. The millionaries are fighting for pennies, Itunes are fighting for pennies and I thought they were going to get rid of pennies.

peace

Yes indeed this is the most interesting thread that has been on here for some time.

I would actually like to dissagree on one point that Seb is making.

Seb, you state that yourself along with many of the record companies do not believe there is that much good music left to be reissued.

You only have to do a search on virtually any artist on this site (with few exceptions). Look at the dicographies of artists like Al Campbell, Cornell Campbell, Leroy Smart, Maytones, Morwells, Barry Brown just to name a few.

Look at these artists discographies and then see how many of the music has been reisseued on vinyl and / or CD. You`ll find it is very little.

There is a wealth of music crying out to be put back out.
But its probably never going to be financially viable to the record companoies as this music will never generate the profit margin that the record companies would demand.

Leggo,

Met one of them? I am one of them. I've spent thousands on reggae that I probably should have put somewhere else (like college funds or car payments). What I'm trying to say is that there needs to be a sense of enthusiasm and energy to get something to stay alive and grow (nature teaches us that). Otherwise, why would people get interested in the first place?
I have noticed when people come on the forum here seeking info about reggae there are some that want to shut them down by telling them that a "real" reggae collector would not like that LP because it's not roots enough or scarce enough. The vibe often gets elitist and condescending. This is not what will keep reggae appealing to those who are starting to get interested. Like I said the way that something keeps going is to make it accessible and to keep the enthusiasm going to the next generation. Then they will be interested enough to buy the product. Some will become DJs, some will become vinyl collectors, etc. The music will keep going.

To be fair, I recently caught myself becoming a reggae music snob. I was disappointed about buying an Ijahman LP that came to me defective. A friend asked what had happened. I told her. She started to let me know about how much she "digs Reggae", "yea mon" "I've listened to Bob Marley a bunch of times", etc. I had to catch myself and get rid of my collector-itis. I ended up having a nice discussion with her about how great reggae is and why I like Ijahman instead of harping at her about how Ijahman is "cooler" and "realer" then Bob (I know some people reading this are thinking Ijahman is total pop, see what I mean, the temptation is always there).

Rootsman wrote:Seb, you state that yourself along with many of the record companies do not believe there is that much good music left to be reissued.

You only have to do a search on virtually any artist on this site (with few exceptions). Look at the dicographies of artists like Al Campbell, Cornell Campbell, Leroy Smart, Maytones, Morwells, Barry Brown just to name a few.

Rootsman,

I probably didn't say what I wanted to in the right way. I completely agree that there are hundreds (and more) great songs from great artists that would deserve a proper reissue. RA is just the iceberg as the greatest tunes unreissued yet are on 7" & 12" singles. That's why it's still possible to make great V.A. albums with previously unavaible tracks on CD.

But as for reissuing original albums, honnestly, who would put money on artists like Al Campbell, Morwells or Leroy Smart ? Noone imho.

As I said compiling "valuable" V.A. albums is a real pain for everyone and will never bring as much money as a Trojan boxset or other uninteresting compilations with titles already reissed dozens of time. That's why I think it won't last long before the reissue market will completely drop.

It's been mentioned by DOOP and Rootsman and now I think Seb is saying sort of the same thing. The interest in purchasing reggae music is in decline. [Of course there are hadcore collectors that will drive the market for rare records, it only takes two people right?]

The question is why the decline, is it because, as I have heard from commentators that the younger generation, and maybe even some folks on here, have reached the point that they actually cannot comprehend BUYING a CD/LP/Cassette etc., since from there earliest days, they could just go find it on the Internet. This is only one point, but this point will effect the entire music industry.

A second possibility is that younger people (the growth portion of the market) are not interested in roots reggae. Perhaps it's too "mellow" and there is a preference for a more "aggressive" sound coming from Hip-Hop.

There was a time when the music that most members here enjoy had a message, sometimes profound, sometimes cheesy, but the music was intended to convey a message and provide social commentary and push for something, (justice, equality, etc.)

The popular music of today is different it's more about getting their share of money/women/parties/cars/boats/planes/goodtimes, and that's what younger listeners want to hear (I'm not judging their taste) and perhaps they think of our reggae the way a lot of people my age thought of my parents 1950s music, as quaint bubble-gum music.

Sorry for the ramble, but I just got going.

Chris

Soemone here may be more in to tech news than I am, but can someone explain to me:

(1) Why CDs cannot be encrypted so that they cannot be copied (this was mentioned earlier in the thread). I thnk this would have had a dramatic impact on illegal downloads, perhaps the toothpaste is out of the tube and you could never get it back in, so maybe now it's too late to even bother. This to me seems like it was the biggest gaffe on the part of the labels. they just didn't understand what the Internet was.

(2) Why the labels didn't take control of digital downloads VERY EARLY on, how is that Apple, a computer maker, becamse the most powerful force in music. What on earth were the fat cat record execs thinking?!?! Even if you explain it to me I will never understand how an entire group of people (the execs) that are supposed to be smart, and on the cutting edge, could have been so short-sighted, narrow-minded, backward-thinking, etc.

Chris

@ Chris ,

Various encryption systems HAVE been tried by the major companies . Most of the time , it interferes with the audible sound . Then the " geeks " get on to it and publish , via the internet , ways of getting round these areas.( I can`t quote specifics , but this has been discussed in the hi-fi press ! )

Brilliant thread. Interesting point made by Jason. I was a DJ, Selector whatever in the 80's. This was cut short when my parents house was burgled in the early 90's. Much was taken, including my vinyl. CD was not long incepted and I foolishly (I was young), let the insurers replace it with CD. For twenty years I have endured others proclaim in not so many words that I am 'not keeping it real' and all that crap; heaven forbid I should attempt playing out with my trusty laptop!, regardless of the fact I have great tunes. In terms of the original point, many people just don't get our music and thats it. I once heard Chris Salewicz say 'what was going on in reggae in the seventies was insane'. That pretty much says it for me, as I'm sure all of you. It's that important, but all the while you have Radio 1, NME, Q & all the rest of these idiots running the face of the music industry, Reggae will not move forward in terms of sales because many new ears just don't hear it. I think it outrageous how you hear practically no roots whatsoever on more contempary radio, but that is what is needed in my opinion

G