Roots Archives Forum

Vinyl. Does it matter if we have lived the JA ghetto experience or not?

If reggae appreceation had been the exclusive reserve of those who lived in the JA ghettos then reggae music would never have gone outernational.

Reggae's spread across the world, mainly in the 70s and 80s, was intimately tied up with the growth of New Wave and Punk, especially in the UK where reggae gained such a huge fan base. The late great John Peel (UK DJ) had a huge role in reggae's spread in the western world.

And we lived in our own working class ghettos, one created by Thatcher and the long unemployment lines, the lack of real opportunity and disatisfaction with the shystem. Of course, they were not as hard, rough and dangerous as Trenchtown, but they were ghettos just the same.

Maybe we are just nostalgic old deadbeats for loving the early roots sounds, but we can't help prefering the music we grew up listening to - which is genuine, authentic, retro roots from the 60 - 85 era.

I do have late 80s and even 90s digital dancehall and Ragga stuff in my collection, but try as I might, I struggle to actually enjoy much music made after the mid - 80s era.

In fact, I think dance music (house, garage etc) is the real evolution of the reggae dub sound (if not the roots message!)

REGGAE MUSIC IS INTERNATIONAL MUSIC.
From Jamaica to Poland from africa to New Zealand.
Please don't dig a artist down if you don't like it.

One love one heart one blood.

Lion

Forward ever backward never.

Lion

Like I said, reggae is world wide exactly because it has been spread OUT of the ghetto where it was born.

And this is a forum, where people are welcome to voice their personal opinion as long as it is done without disrespect and rudeness.

Music is FREE SPEECH....you do not have to like/love or listen to any band. You opinion is fine.
We do not HAVE to all agree on everything on forums. I find that it's all or nothing on most boards. If you do not follow the sheep, they cut you off at the knees eternally when you post an adverse opinion.
This board is unique as I have not experienced that here YET.....
I am a ROOTS/Rock Steady person, but I just caught the tour with Gregory, Capelton and Buju and "bwoi" the show was sensational! Buju sang DESTINY, and the vibes of that song are conscious and the whole crowd sang along~
I prefer Mighty Diamonds, Burning Spear, Lucky Dube, CULTURE,Richie Spice, Sanchez, Beres Hammond and I also heard on www.consciousradio.net (sundays only) Keety Roots, who I have never heard of before....I keep my mind open with music and life in general~

An open mind is a working mind...

It is true that you don't have to live in Jamaican ghettoes to appreciate Reggae music. But you should understand something of them to understand the differences in the music. For example the frenetic pace of Ska had much to do with the hopes associated with Independence. Then you had Roacksteady which was a lot mellower as people came to settle into post-Independence with its nrealized hopes. At the same time there was alot of songs about Rudie culture as young men who came to the city became caught up in this lifestyle. Then came Reggae. Much of Reggae from the early 70's was infused by the hope for better things especially with the election of the PNP. Tunes like "Better Must Come" and such. Then as the 76 elections approached and JLP Gunmen largely armed by the CIA battled with PNP gunmen there came a greater stridency and militancy to the music. Tunes like "Ballistic Affair" & "Police & Thieves" & "War Inna Babylon". There was also greater recourse to Biblical millenialism in things like "Two 7's Clash". When the JLP took power in the 80's and Jamaica was opened up to the "Free Market" and IMF depredations many Jamaicans turned inward and music became more concerned with day to day life as well as escapism. It is also a time when the new artists new nothing but the city. Where as many early Reggae artists like Bob Marley had come from the country. So even though they grew up in Trench Town, Ghost Town, Back O Wall, Greenwich Farm or wherever, they knew the values of the country. With the onset of the 80's you had a whole generation of artists who knew nothing but life in the Ghettoes. Of course these are simplifications based on genralisations but I feel they have merit. Eventually Reagan succeeded in convincing Seaga to suppress Ganja and Jamaica became a transhipment point for the Cocaine trade. Political gunmen became drug posses and violence exploded. Jamaica has experienced crack and all its attendant horrors in the mean time. It has also been dealing with the economic implications of IMF & World Bank policies. Reggae is a reflection of all this. Its not simply Ganja-laced, Bible Influence calls to Love, Harmony, Repatriation, Black Liberation theology or simply a better world based on Christianity or Country values. It is also trying to eat or find a job; it is having fun dancing or going to the Sound Systems; it is SEX, money and the desire for nice things based on Ghetto living and mass media. It emulates the Coke Don, Gunman or cocksman as well as Haile Selassie, Jesus and Marcus Garvey. In short Reggae is a reflection of Jamaica. As Jamaica becomes open to outside influences, be they cultural or economic, so is Reggae. Jamaicans don't exist in an idealised vaccum. They live in Real world, one that is often harsh but also beautiful. As Jamaica changes so will Reggae. And like the rest of world globalism will continue to have a signifcant impact on that change. Just as Bob Marley and Peter Tosh added rock style lead guitars to their bands, or Soul Syndicate was influenced by Al Green's band, so modern artists will be influenced by Hip-Hop and R&B, as well as Indian or Arab music. The business of Reggae will also reflect this global shift. Now none of this means you have to like what is being produced today but you shouldn't simply dismiss it out of hand because it doesn't reflect your tastes or experiences. As with everything, IMHO, you should try and put yourself into the shoes (or mind) of others if you want to understand why they do something. Don't try a measure another with the ruler of your experience. Often one is in inches and the other metric and understanding is lost in the translation.

Ites,
Papa D

What you are saying papa D is that reggae music is no longer roots music but music influenced by the USA Gangsta scene. Which is one of the things I dislike about the new sound.

I don't like hip hop and I don't like modern mainstream reggae sound. In fact, I don't even think it is reggae but something diferent. It may have evolved out of reggae but it is a different beast.

Everyone has the right to make their own sound but we old skool rockers have the right to dislike it!

for me some of the best current roots style reggae is performed by non-jamaican groups such as 10ft ganja plant and fat freddies drop. they seem to have preserved the sound of the 70's better than some jamaican artists - and whats wrong with that?

My point about Reggae is that is has always been subject to outside influences. The Wailers and other groups were highly influenced by the Impressions. Much of early Reggae was influenced by US Soul music. Does that make it any less Reggae? Not in my opinion. And to me to say what is being played today isn't Reggae is like saying Charlie Parker & John Coltrane didn't play Jazz. It is putting constraints on the music that the people creating aren't. As far as what music you like, of course that is eveybody's own choice. I don't really like most of the Reggae coming out today. This is based on both style & content. I by far prefer Reggae from the 70's to early 80's-mainly what this board is dedicated to. Just like I like Jazz from the mid-40's to mid-60's. Even when artists are palying in the same style today it doesn't have the same appeal to me. Because it comes from a different time & place. But I don't feel its right for me to tell somebody that they aren't playing Reggae because they aren't playing the Reggae I like. These are just my opinions which I feel strongly about because I feel strongly about Reggae as I am sure many others on this board do. But I do find it ironic that in a thread called why I can't tolerate new roots reggae intolerance is one of the reasons given.

Ites,
Papa D

I wonder if people in the 70s complained about this new roots style comparing it to the music they grew up with.