Educate Yourself

[MightyZ]

if i were in charge, hemp and flax would be everywhere

http://www.jackherer.com

check this out for some interesting hemp facts, including an interesting article from Popular Mechanics in 1938 showing how the new machinery would make hemp production viable in the US, so US labour could be employed instead of buying from overseas plantations where workers were exploited to keep prices low and profits high

Jack Herer Dub on Mighty Dub album was written after reading this, and is not actually about the time in Amsterdam that...

As for vegetarianism, I was glad to see the day that leggorocker finally decided to follow his young brothers example

MightyZ
Hear Mighty Dub on www.soundclick.com/themightyzallstars

[leggo rocker]

Yep, MightyZ has been veggie from birth, a natural. I instead had to discover it after years of ignorance, when I was 17.

I now have 5 lucky children who are all born veggies (and no worse for it - better in fact I'd argue).

[Nefta]

What about corn?? Everything i eat and read the products the corn is always there.Isn't the corn production part of the problem?

[leggo rocker]

Corn production can be a problem. But the problem is made worse because so much corn is grown and then fed to animals as feed and this process is a VERY inefficient use of food.

It takes a lot of space, water and feed to 'grow' cattle, pigs and chickens. I don't remember the exact ratios but meat production is something like 300:1. That means, to produce one pound of meat you must use the same amount of resources that would produce 300 pounds of edible vegetarian food.

Now of course, the prospect of bio fuel production is going to make matters worse. All because the petro chemical companies and their cronies in governments are trying to hold onto their financial interests.

Why do we need to burn anything when we have an abundance of wind, wave and water power?

[super ape]

another major problem with corn is the fact that so much if not almost all has already been gmo-tainted. years ago (how many, i don't know) they decided to mix and match so many corn species that were gmo derived that getting corn grown organically has to be specifically sought out. who knows what is really in those corn chips that you get at the burrito shack. not to mention the tomatoes with cod genes in them.
all for the sake of higher yeild, longer shelf life, and cheaper farming expenses.
i really think that humans are probably the stupidest species on the planet. but like minds, meaning thinking people like ourselves, can hopefully change that!
peace

[Jah Titus]

Right Leggo!
Jesus said: NUH SHEDING INNOCENT BLOOD. Ting dem call xmas besides hypocrisy, pure vanity an massive insanity is like apotheosis of babylon holocaust.


Blessed a de meek an humble

[Chris]

the biggest global issue is people need to stop buy things from big companies, if that stop dat would ballance back the good old vibes. no joke ting i talk its true.

As an economist, I couldn't let this one pass without comment. Believe me I avoid the big box stores as much as possible and I try to support locally owned businesses whenever I can, even if that means paying a little more.

It is not the fault of the big companies, much of the "blame" lies at the feet of we the consumers and the advertisers that make people believe they "need" rather than "want" the latest TV, clothes, gadgets, etc.

Again, I am not a supporter of the Wal-Mart's of the world, but if we the people demand all of these goods someone will supply them, and it could be argued that if we want to make the best use of our scarce resources, then the Wal-Mart way of doing things is probably a more efficient way to get there.

The destruction of our environment in the name of profits is driven by the fact that people do not want to pay the true cost of their consumption. Europe has done a far better job than America in levying appropriate taxes to force the consumers to pay something closer to the true cost of consumption.

A major hurdle that must be crossed is educating more people as to the cost of their activities. I teach Environmental Economics and when the course ends one of the most common commets is, "Why doesn't everybody know about these issues?"

To reiterate, it is not the fault of large corporations for producing externalities and "exploitating" resources around the world it is the fault of our governments and their lax regulations, mortgaging our future for the sake of the present and pushing the costs onto future generations creating massive intergenerational inequity. What we need are some strong politicians (espesically in the US) who are willing to stand up to the lobbyists and corporate interests and explain to the people, what we are doing is wrong and to save our planet we need to start TODAY. But alas, that won't happen, the politicians have too much on the line personally to rock the boat and speak the truth for fear of being labeled a crazed liberal.

Perhaps two of the best comments on the current state of our environment came 30 years ago, just check out "Hurt Not The Earth" by Little Roy or "Oil Ina Babylon" by General Echo.

Just some thoughts from someone who spends a lot of time thinking about these things.

Chris

[MightyZ]

How can the Big Corporations not take some blame here Chris?

Don't they pay the Advertising companies to make us feel we need their goods in order to make more profit?

Sure the consumer who won't pay a fair price is partly to blame, but so is the corporation boss who takes a huge salary whilst his agents beat the prices down that they pay the farmers to the point where the farmers can only just survive to grow more?

Yes, governments have a role in being tougher to stop such practices, but that doesn't absolve those who choose to exploit that weakness!

Surely, those who benefit from the production most, have a moral duty to provide for and protect those who are feeding them these massive profits and fat cat salaries?

MightyZ

PS I only have a BA honours degree in Economics and thus am obviously a less qualified Economist than you, but I feel that somehow you have been indoctrinated if you feel every one else is to blame and somehow the corporations are not themselves responsible for their externalities and exploiting resources!

[Chris]

Mighty Z,
You wrote:
"I feel that somehow you have been indoctrinated if you feel every one else is to blame and somehow the corporations are not themselves responsible for their externalities and exploiting resources!"

Based on your response I think I may have not made myself clear. The corporations are to blame, but ask yourself, why do they exploit our natural resources? Because consumers and other firms demand goods and services. I'm pretty darn far to the left on the political spectrum, but I understand the power of market forces (see e-bay for an example of a free market that elicits the "fair" market price).

The reason we end up with externalities is that somewhere along the line, either the producers (corporations) or consumers (you and I) do not bear the full costs of their actions that are imposed on society. If consumers sharply reduced their demand for pollution creating products/activities, corporations would no longer find it profitable to produce those goods and switch to more environmentally friendly products. These big corporations are in business to make profits and if we don't buy what they are selling or demand greener products they will be forced to change their practices to continue to generate profits for their shareholders.

In the US we have seen Exxon-Mobil have record profits, the response by the public is that Exxon-Mobil is somehow taking advantage of us by increasing the price of gasoline (petrol). The fact of the matter is that even at $3.30 per gallon, we are still way underpaying for gasoline, but most Americans don't want to face that fact. Americans do not pay anything close to the true cost of gasoline consumption; greenhouse gases, urban sprawl, degradation of roads, buildings, bridges, not to mention the health costs associated with air pollution. No, rather than recognize that our insatiable demand for gasoline is the problem, people immediately point to Exxon-Mobil and their profits, and they're the problem and want the price to fall which would make it possible to consume even more gasoline.

Mighty Z: "Yes, governments have a role in being tougher to stop such practices, but that doesn't absolve those who choose to exploit that weakness!"

Since you have a background in economics you know that with the existence of negative externalities, we will always have overproduction, unless someone (the government) steps in and either taxes the activity or regulates the activity.

I personally can't stand the practices of many of our giant corporations, the way they destroy our environment, the way they take advantage of the political system, the way they take advantage of labor, the incredible disparity between the pay of executives versus low level employees, etc., and I do not absolve them of negative business practices, but I understand their rationale and incentives.

Mighty Z: "Don't they pay the Advertising companies to make us feel we need their goods in order to make more profit?"

The corporations pay for advertising out of revenue generated by you and I buying their goods and services. If we didn't buy their products, they wouldn't have the revenue to buy advertising.

Chris

[leggo rocker]

I agree with MightyZ. The big corps are hell bent on making profits, usually without regard to the environment. Nowadays we have big corps making a show of being green, but this is just marketing and usually very hollow.

Many years ago, I was asked to give a speech the question: Do the Green Political Movements have a future? This I duly did and shocked my audience, who knew my eco-veggie-rebel credentials, by starting my speech by saying:

"Green Politics have no future"

Then I went on to explain to the audience that, due to our vanity, our compulsive consumption and our total lack of care for the future, we were all doomed and thus Green Politics and the entire human race had no future - or at least a future that was dark and hellish.

Sadly, this viewpoint, expressed more than 15 years ago, has not been changed, but actually re-enforced.

But then it is written, in most 'bibles' that the human race will descend to its ultimate doom due to vanity, corruption and greed. And here we go...down down, deeper and down.

There is no future except with the love of God in our hearts. And there's very little of that about nowadays.