4th Street Orchestra

[Max]

I'v been looking for any of their LPs and singles for a while but never really found anyting except a 7" on ebay couple of days ago. This group is totaly wicked. just like Matumbi, but I guess they are pretty much the same group.

Are these records really that hard to get, and how about Matumbis "Ah Who Seh Go Deh"? Whats the difference between 4th Street and Matumbi, except that 4th Street is mostly just riddim?

Thanks, Max

[Fabroots]

"Leggo" and "You learn" albums have both 2 songs in for each, good ones. A friend had tell me that they are Matumbi early name, nothing more, i cant give more infos...
"A who say go deh" is a flat album of Matumbi for my tastes, apart the song "Za-ion", killer!

[wareika]

Actually, there are two "official" reasons for the different named Bovell gave to Matumbi (4th Street O is more or less Matumbi).

The first one was to fool the sound system operators who overlooked the UK acts back in days. So they changed the name and issued the first LP in a Jam pre-release style with no infos. It does not really worked cause a radio dj recognize Matumbi singer voice. This is what Bovel explained in an interview.

The second was just because matumbi had a deal with Safari (not sure of the label) and they had to release this material with another name due to the contract. As explained in the sleeves notes of "Point Of View" LP.

The first one is IMO, hhhhuuuummmm, just a kinda of legend. By 77, when the first 4th Street O LP appeared, matumbi was well recognised and introduced in the sound system world. They already had a huge lovers rock hit with After Tonight... The second is more realist.

Oh, there is a third one IMO: changing name is just part of the fun in reggae. Too many exemples.


wareika

[collieman]

I think wareika gives the good explaination,as told in "point of view" innersleeve it was due to contract's problem.

I think also 4th street orchestra was a dub project especially for Dennis bovell, there is not so much vocals in these LPs,We could suppose that Matumbi was composed by some other musicians than 4 th street orchestra,I m sure that most are the same but Matumbi is another entity.
Also I think Matumbi's leader was more Bevin Bagga Fagan than Dennis Bovell,Noone can hide Bovell's influence in producing & in the music composition but the soul of matumbi is the Fagan brothers (as you can see on Reggae ina Babylon Video).
We can see on the V.a Tempus the "Blood ah Go run" tune is credited to Dennis Bovell & not to matumbi (i remember on another label credited to Dennis"matumbi" Bovell).
Also Many tunes composed by most of matumbi's memebers have been published on another name,surely because it was not bevin bagga fagan on lead vocals or it missed some musicians.

all i know:
4 th street orchestra (dub & vocal)
Sufferer Sound (dub)

Bagga (cant satisfy & Daughters of zion)
Matumbi
African Brothers (Jah Bunny on lead vocal)
African Stone (Jah Bunny on lead vocal)
Riot Squad (Glaister Fagan & Euton Jones on lead)

I also met Euton Jones on vocal on Brimstone Name Brimstone "Fancy Living"12" Lab Karnak great Tune...

[Max]

Much thanks for all the info, very interesting. Now Iv got a lot to look for. Rite dem on Ah Who Seh Go Deh is a nice tune too imo, I like them all actually but Za-ion is as you said the killer.

Thanks again, Max.

[fadel diagne]

hi the 4th street orchestra is is the band minustex dixon,nicolas bailey and etan jones,but with jah bunny on drums this time
what happened is that matumbi at the very beginning was comprised by1971 bytex dixon on vocals,dennis bowell on guitar,erroll pottinger on guitaretan jones on drums,bevin"bagga"fagan,glaister fagan and nicolas bailey on vocalsand were initially known for covering funk hits(kool and the gang funky stuff)and backing visiting reggae bands to the uk.they recorded for trojan between 1972 and 1973as i said"reggae stuff"based on the kool and the gand"funky stuff"and"wipe them out"but trojan was only interested in their cover works not their original material.
but in 1976they released their seminal single"after tonight" produced by loyd coxone and which hit the chart in 1976 after it ws released by one reg mc lean on his "safari" label and culminated at n1 in the british chart.trojan reacted and claimed that bovell and co were still under contract with them.the band felt that coxone(not to be mistaken by clement coxone dodd of studio one)was indifferent to the band sudden rise to the top and parted company with him.the band didn't appreciate trojan attitude either and were obliged to record under various aliases like african stone under which rhey recorded"how long must i wait"and "run rasta run"for buster pearson's"k&b label;trojan having noticed the subterfuge decided not to hold them under contract any longer."man in me"which was a bob dylan 's composition received a reggae treatment by the group in released by"matumbi music corp"established by bovell in 1976"chain gang(originally by sam cook"and"daughter of zion"by bagga faganwere released following the aforementioned two"a who say go? deh!"was released under the name"forth street orchestra" bydip'simprint rama,as their first album;bovell and matumbi were latter to release on their mainline label"gimme african love"as the african brothers".trojan nevertheless gained the rights for"after tonight"and"man in me" and released them back to back.
so definetely "fourth street orchestra""african stone""african brothers"and "matumbi"are definetely the same band with different variations
i hope i have been of little help
fadel